Thursday, March 10, 2011
Why 9mm-Gabe Suarez-Part 3 from Warriortalk
1). 9mm holds more ammo and more ammo is a definite asset in a gunfight. I had a student that was attacked by three guys and his 1911 barely had enough. Another bad guy and he would have been screwed.
2). With modern ammo there is virtually no difference in performance in the typical CCW loads (9mm, 40, 45).
3). Ammo commonality and magazine commonality are a big issue. If you carry a 50 Auto +P+ and your dainty wife carries a mere 9mm you cannot support each other in the way that would be best.
4). Anyone who believe in One Shot Stops with a pistol is a freaking idiot that has never seen action otther than in his daydreams.
Look gents, if it makes you feel better to carry a 45, do it. If you think that extra millimeter of size will help, then carry a 45. If you think you'd feel just fine at Mumbai with your 1911/45, then cool. Drive on. Its not my business to convice you otherwise.
Me? I have seen lots of people shot to be able to say this.
ALL HANDGUN CALIBERS ARE UNPREDICTABLE. I have seen guys get shot with just about everything and nothing will work every time. I know of a guy shot in the chest with a 70 caliber shotgun slug and who not only survived but kept fighting. The ONLY sure way, and that is still in question, is to multiply the damage. How do we do that? by lots and lots of holes....hopefully in chest and face.
One of my contacts in South America has a score of 47...many of those with a Glock 17 with Military FMJ. He prevailed by being generous with his trigger and accurate in his shooting. Good enough for me. For me, its a 9mm Glock 17 with alot of Corbon DPX rounds.
Jeff Cooper created a cult of the 1911/45. He also did his best to convince everyone that it would work 19 times out of 20. Yet, in a book written about the types of weapons/ammo where Cooper got most of his combat experience, Fairbairn states that one man he knew emptied his 45 into a thug whom he had to club into unconsciousness with the empty pistol. Moreover, the Moro Wars used to promote the "stopping power" of the 45 where suppressed with the shotgun and not the pistol.
That is not to say the 45 is worthless as it is not. If I was limited by foolish laws to 10 rounds or less, or to FMJ ammo, I might opt for such a pistol, but I think the lack of capacity is a serious limitation.
I investigated an attempted suicide once where a man shot himself in the head with a 1911. He lived and walked out of the ER. What does that prove? Nothing other than the 1911/45 is NOT the death ray excalibur its cult would have us all assume.
I was also present in an entry where a drug dealer was kiled with one shot from a Sig P226/9mm +P+ 115 gr JHP. The man fel before the Point Man could hit him again. What does that prove? That the 9mm is not the POS, or the "45 set on stun" MT fools like to call it.
For perspective I also saw several gang killings with 22 pistols. No lack of stopping power there.
In my educated and experienced opinion, ALL handgun calibers will do about the same things in flesh. I have had ER docs tell me directly that they have seen folks shot with 45 drop and die, as well as walk around as if nothing happened. We have info of the same things happening with just about every caliber out there. Chuck Taylor told me once of a Viet Cong who got his entire shoulder blown off by a 50 BMG that kept charging until he bled out. So again IMHO, the arguement of the Power Of The Pistol is simply stupid.
We carry them for convenience and not for power. The secret to dropping the adversary is not the caliber, it is the volume and the placement. Period.
So carry the biggest weapon you can control. That does not mean caliber. It means weapon size. And that includes capacity. Guy say they have Para Ords with 13 rounds of 45 and Glock 21s with similar payloads. great. THAT is the primary test for selection. For me, both of those pistols have an umanageable girth. I cannot shoot them as well as a Glock 17/22. If those who advocate them can, then I support their choice 100%.
I have a friend named Pierre. he is a big man with big hands and can shoot a Desert Eagle as well as I can my Glock 17. It would be foolish for me to force him to carry a Glock 17 and equally so for him to tell me that only his D.E. was suitable for combat.
Choose based on shootability - ignore the caliber...can you manage the weapon's size in your hand, in daily carry? Then choose on capacity. More ammo is more better. You will NOT be dropping one man with one sho. It will be taking more. One man, no big deal. Two men, maybe not a big deal. Three men and your seven shots begin looking bad. Four men and you will be forced to reload. But not with a high capacity weapon. Caliber is the last consideration to me.
Anything in 9mm, 40 S&W, 357 Sig, 45 ACP, 38 Sp. will work about the same. So CHOOSE WHAT YOU LIKE. As I said, mine is a Glock 17 with three magazines of Corbon DPX (and a couple of happy sticks thrown in).
Posted by Gabe Suarez on Warriortalk and reprinted here with permission.Full thread HERE .
at 1:28 PM